Good deep dive - I read Greer's take on this about how he see's this girl as an embodiment of modern red state culture which is also interesting. To me this is just more evidence of the underclass suffering after being unshackled completely - as you point out this isn't new behavior but it was more moderated or controlled. This is the big difference to the past I think, the old rules were better defined and understood. Now there is anarchy across the underclasses as a whole.
I could have gone even deeper into the biography of her life, there definitely seems to be something tragic there... It seemed that her self conception was "yeah, I'm in college right now, but I'm going back to my small town of 700 people and never leaving." Why? We talk about delayed adolescence in men, but what does that symbolize? But too much individual psychoanalysis in that direction was at the risk of losing the focus on the general "archetype."
That's a great catch. I shouldn't be using weasel words without backing it up. Have edited that sentence to be a question rather than a statement of fact.
This is fantastic writing and your thesis is solid, not that you need to hear it from me. Glad Substack served your goods up for my consumption.
"Men adopt positions like “all women are like that” to feel better about their failures with women."
I think you're right that many men have fallen into that trap. I would also suggest that some men, men who have had a lot of experience with women, perhaps not just in dating but as husbands and fathers of daughters, might also say that "all women are similar". At least, they are in certain ways.
I think that "Hawk Tuah" girl will settle down if she can find a man willing to wrangle her. Maybe that is what she wants, to be dominated a little. Maybe many women want that. Just a little. But it will be hard for a dude to walk the aisle with her knowing that tiktok is out there.
Lesson for everyone: Never, ever, ever, let anyone record you while you are inebriated. Maybe that's why bars are being replaced with at home drinking.
To your point, even some porn stars get married! I actually wonder what the marital rate of porn stars is. My hypothesis is that porn stars get married at a much higher rate (20%?) than other female groups (self-identified asexuals, for example). So while we often think that hypersexuality is the greatest threat to the institution of marriage, objectively, it is hyposexuality which is more dangerous. But I don't have the data on hand to prove that -- I'll keep looking!
I'd love to see the data on porn star marriages. I wouldn't know how to begin to track down that info. I hope you have a lead!
My guess is that there are very few porn stars who found good provider, left the biz, had children, and have been married for 10 years are more. I'd expect the typical porn star marriage story is sad and full of various dramas.
I agree that porn star marriages involve higher rates of promiscuity. My point was merely that asexuals are less sexually and romantically successful than "sluts." Whether or not this equates to happiness is another question, but at least on the level of "brute biology," porn stars are "healthier." Haven't got the stats to back this up as I'm sure even self identified "asexuals" have a fertility rate above 0.0.
Higher levels of education and higher income than their male counterparts means women would rather remain single and childless. Southern Europe and East Asia being the most recent examples of dramatic and drastic collapses in birth rates that are seemingly irreversible and are defended by the women as simply the result of our collective choice. That is the Garden of Eden in real life
AWALT is risk mitigation. The point is that you can never know for sure if a woman may betray or mistreat you until it has already happened, so you should be prepared for the possibility. I agree that of course people turn it into a stupid repetitive dogma, because that is what people do, but I believe this is the instinct behind its staying power. It is a male correspondent to a woman's fear of being abused physically; even though of course only a tiny number of men are actually a threat to her in this way, she doesn't know which ones they are, and the negative outcome if it does happen is extremely severe. It's quite understandable to be a bit paranoid in those circumstances.
Anyways, I would posit that perhaps simply having money is another avenue to success here. One of the big features of a PhD is that it usually correlates with money and economic stability. If you didn't go to college but you are financially stable or even quite wealthy, I wonder if having a PhD would still matter at that point.
I would also question the idea of pursuing a graduate degree just so you can date liberal women but this comment is long enough already.
In terms of hereditarian versus environment, I’d also say these go hand in hand. The environment influences the immediate genetic proclivities, which is then passed on through their children. I’d also agree that the most sexually selective, high IQ of women still value credentials as we live in a managerial regime. What I would say, is that statistics show if a man makes more money than a woman, but is not credentialed, she doesn’t care. But interestingly if he has a degree and she still makes more than him, he is seen as lower status.
Credentialism as proxy for mate selection is failing, because the managerial elite are becoming dysgenic, are completely comfortable, and insulated. The living standards they’ve produced for the bottom half of society, which includes more than capable middle-classed, and lower middle classed individuals with great merits (some would say even greater conscientiousness), who’re being pushed into poverty. Ironically it was Marx who predicted this cohort was the first to turn to fascism as they view the upper-middle class bourgeoisie as traitors and backstabbers. This credentialed elite has succeeded in locking out this cohort, and are creating a rebellious counter elite that is attempting to corral the mass against them. There are many deeply intelligent people who ought to be in universities, and have been denied their place in the elite, denied the process of social mobility, and will burn down the entire power structure to get what they view as theirs.
So I'm not familiar with Canada's 55% post-secondary rate specifically, but as far as America, I'll share this opinion: you are correct that a Bachelor's degree is extremely diluted from even 30 years ago in terms of selectivity (intelligence, conscientiousness, openness) since anyone can get into these programs. However, the trend that I identify is this doesn't mean the end of selection, rather, the moving of goal posts, so now you have to get a Master's or PhD to get into a truly selective program. When we actually look at the statistics, we find huge differences between highschool graduates, college graduates, and post-grads. I could be more convincing on this point if I took the time to write "In Defense of College" showing the data on each group and comparing them...
The clarify, what I mean by credentialism as proxy for mate selection is failing because credentialism itself is no longer a guarantee for competence. Canada for example, 55% of the population has post-secondary education and absolutely nothing to show for it. Canada is a failing country in real time. The civilization-wide competency crisis, the pathologies and neuroses of this credentialed elite has plummeted faith in institutions by all members of society excluding those already part of it, which increasingly is made up of would-be elites denied access to what should be theirs
Look at the state of Canada right now and tell me if you think elite overproduction did anything to benefit, slow or stop its current issues.
Canada has the lowest upwards mobility out of 20 countries for young people in the OECD. It will not economically recover until the 2050s at the earliest. Canada is entering a lost decade and is already in a recession, which is currently being ignored because it’s pasted over with the 1.2-2.2 million immigrants entering it annually, which is propping up GDP.
This newcomer number is also pasting over a massive exodus of educated Canadians who are leaving for greener pastures, primarily the United States. I guarantee if you cross reference BA holders with those working in government jobs, they’ll have higher salaries, because the federal government is the largest employer in the country. Absolutely none of these indicate Canada has anything to show for it.
I'm making a specific and simple point: education impacts sexual selection. I provided a direct statistic to that point. You seem to be talking about something much broader. I'm talking about how individual women mate with individual men, and how that process is impacted by education. You're talking about some larger issue of how degrees are fake and the economy is imploding. Both of those things can be true at the same time. Degrees can both be diminishing in value to the overall "real" economy, while at the same time playing a role in sexual selection.
The only bug in the thesis is the reliance on, well, an unreliable source called Tinder. I’ve played (with, on,
In) gay versions for several decades. I’ve been the #1 most connected (I don’t like liked) or perhaps notorious, on some. Then I calculated the π r² problem and met Mr. #2 at a nightclub in Barcelona.
#2 was a pimp, knew me at sight, and introduced me to several rent men from ‘the dating app’
Ahh. And the movie producers. Muscular bronzed bearded endowed Poseidon or Zeus figures are quite in demand as prostitutes. I missed my career as a rock hard god.
The chance you talk to ‘a girl’, as you started down the path, is proportional to how far away they are. The candidate pool goes up quite rapidly with the square of the radius irrespective of education.
Sadly the chance you meet someone goes down as the inverse square of the radius. Sadly you’ll meet quite a few people in a pool 1000 miles in radius, but will chance you meet them is zero.
In fact, if you even talk with them you accelerate your isolation because well, there’s only 24 hours in a day, and you are killing time. Using an app isn’t the antitheses of getting laid.
Internet connect people but not sex organs. Quite bad.
I think for a horny gay man, the limit is around a mile, at best. I mean who wants to drive all the way across SF when you can wait for them to come to you… and wait. And wait some more.
In a bar - remember those? Mr. Goodbar? Talking and flirting? Effortlessly easy. Call a Waymo. Bring some friends. Go bar hopping. Good clean fun.
My friends and I who have achieved the near legendary rich muscle daddy nerd visionary hotness tech stratosphere iconic hung HIV-immune homozygous CCR5 delta-32 multilingual multinational status, know that walking to a place where there are people who know who you are is how you get laid all you want. “Cheers”.
Apps are for saps. The house always wins. The more
You play the more you don’t get laid.
Straight and gay, the most popular guys and gals will be hookers, and the fun overeducated are far from
The app having a life, in burning man getting laid, in Mexico on the riviera with friends getting laid, is with friend in Tahiti or have gone en mass to Corsica, or rented a monastery at Ulm, but not wasting quality sex time texting. Naked in the pools of Ventana, 200g of Sass, a nice joint, and more pleasure that people imagine.
Apps are not for the executive women I know. And I know quite a few.
Good deep dive - I read Greer's take on this about how he see's this girl as an embodiment of modern red state culture which is also interesting. To me this is just more evidence of the underclass suffering after being unshackled completely - as you point out this isn't new behavior but it was more moderated or controlled. This is the big difference to the past I think, the old rules were better defined and understood. Now there is anarchy across the underclasses as a whole.
I could have gone even deeper into the biography of her life, there definitely seems to be something tragic there... It seemed that her self conception was "yeah, I'm in college right now, but I'm going back to my small town of 700 people and never leaving." Why? We talk about delayed adolescence in men, but what does that symbolize? But too much individual psychoanalysis in that direction was at the risk of losing the focus on the general "archetype."
“Most men are convinced that a majority of women are promiscuous.” Where are you getting that from? Which men?
That's a great catch. I shouldn't be using weasel words without backing it up. Have edited that sentence to be a question rather than a statement of fact.
This is fantastic writing and your thesis is solid, not that you need to hear it from me. Glad Substack served your goods up for my consumption.
"Men adopt positions like “all women are like that” to feel better about their failures with women."
I think you're right that many men have fallen into that trap. I would also suggest that some men, men who have had a lot of experience with women, perhaps not just in dating but as husbands and fathers of daughters, might also say that "all women are similar". At least, they are in certain ways.
I think that "Hawk Tuah" girl will settle down if she can find a man willing to wrangle her. Maybe that is what she wants, to be dominated a little. Maybe many women want that. Just a little. But it will be hard for a dude to walk the aisle with her knowing that tiktok is out there.
Lesson for everyone: Never, ever, ever, let anyone record you while you are inebriated. Maybe that's why bars are being replaced with at home drinking.
Anyway, great essay. Good luck.
To your point, even some porn stars get married! I actually wonder what the marital rate of porn stars is. My hypothesis is that porn stars get married at a much higher rate (20%?) than other female groups (self-identified asexuals, for example). So while we often think that hypersexuality is the greatest threat to the institution of marriage, objectively, it is hyposexuality which is more dangerous. But I don't have the data on hand to prove that -- I'll keep looking!
I'd love to see the data on porn star marriages. I wouldn't know how to begin to track down that info. I hope you have a lead!
My guess is that there are very few porn stars who found good provider, left the biz, had children, and have been married for 10 years are more. I'd expect the typical porn star marriage story is sad and full of various dramas.
It's getting really silly now. Those "marriages "are like gay marriages with in built infidelity.
I agree that porn star marriages involve higher rates of promiscuity. My point was merely that asexuals are less sexually and romantically successful than "sluts." Whether or not this equates to happiness is another question, but at least on the level of "brute biology," porn stars are "healthier." Haven't got the stats to back this up as I'm sure even self identified "asexuals" have a fertility rate above 0.0.
Goethe wasn’t a virgin but newton was
Good correction. I've edited the sentence in line with your suggestion.
Higher levels of education and higher income than their male counterparts means women would rather remain single and childless. Southern Europe and East Asia being the most recent examples of dramatic and drastic collapses in birth rates that are seemingly irreversible and are defended by the women as simply the result of our collective choice. That is the Garden of Eden in real life
AWALT is risk mitigation. The point is that you can never know for sure if a woman may betray or mistreat you until it has already happened, so you should be prepared for the possibility. I agree that of course people turn it into a stupid repetitive dogma, because that is what people do, but I believe this is the instinct behind its staying power. It is a male correspondent to a woman's fear of being abused physically; even though of course only a tiny number of men are actually a threat to her in this way, she doesn't know which ones they are, and the negative outcome if it does happen is extremely severe. It's quite understandable to be a bit paranoid in those circumstances.
Anyways, I would posit that perhaps simply having money is another avenue to success here. One of the big features of a PhD is that it usually correlates with money and economic stability. If you didn't go to college but you are financially stable or even quite wealthy, I wonder if having a PhD would still matter at that point.
I would also question the idea of pursuing a graduate degree just so you can date liberal women but this comment is long enough already.
I also question the PhD, hence, "Maybe there is a mysterious third way…" But I think comparing AWALT to female paranoia is very apt!
In terms of hereditarian versus environment, I’d also say these go hand in hand. The environment influences the immediate genetic proclivities, which is then passed on through their children. I’d also agree that the most sexually selective, high IQ of women still value credentials as we live in a managerial regime. What I would say, is that statistics show if a man makes more money than a woman, but is not credentialed, she doesn’t care. But interestingly if he has a degree and she still makes more than him, he is seen as lower status.
Credentialism as proxy for mate selection is failing, because the managerial elite are becoming dysgenic, are completely comfortable, and insulated. The living standards they’ve produced for the bottom half of society, which includes more than capable middle-classed, and lower middle classed individuals with great merits (some would say even greater conscientiousness), who’re being pushed into poverty. Ironically it was Marx who predicted this cohort was the first to turn to fascism as they view the upper-middle class bourgeoisie as traitors and backstabbers. This credentialed elite has succeeded in locking out this cohort, and are creating a rebellious counter elite that is attempting to corral the mass against them. There are many deeply intelligent people who ought to be in universities, and have been denied their place in the elite, denied the process of social mobility, and will burn down the entire power structure to get what they view as theirs.
So I'm not familiar with Canada's 55% post-secondary rate specifically, but as far as America, I'll share this opinion: you are correct that a Bachelor's degree is extremely diluted from even 30 years ago in terms of selectivity (intelligence, conscientiousness, openness) since anyone can get into these programs. However, the trend that I identify is this doesn't mean the end of selection, rather, the moving of goal posts, so now you have to get a Master's or PhD to get into a truly selective program. When we actually look at the statistics, we find huge differences between highschool graduates, college graduates, and post-grads. I could be more convincing on this point if I took the time to write "In Defense of College" showing the data on each group and comparing them...
The clarify, what I mean by credentialism as proxy for mate selection is failing because credentialism itself is no longer a guarantee for competence. Canada for example, 55% of the population has post-secondary education and absolutely nothing to show for it. Canada is a failing country in real time. The civilization-wide competency crisis, the pathologies and neuroses of this credentialed elite has plummeted faith in institutions by all members of society excluding those already part of it, which increasingly is made up of would-be elites denied access to what should be theirs
Provide a source backing up your "nothing to show for it" claim. Here's mine:
https://univcan.ca/media-room/publications/universities-help-canadians-get-ahead-quick-facts/
The average income for all Canadians in 2020 was $51.9K.
The average income with a bachelor’s degree was $68.3K.
That's a $680k return over 40 years, and tuition is only $40k for a Bachelor's Degree.
Look at the state of Canada right now and tell me if you think elite overproduction did anything to benefit, slow or stop its current issues.
Canada has the lowest upwards mobility out of 20 countries for young people in the OECD. It will not economically recover until the 2050s at the earliest. Canada is entering a lost decade and is already in a recession, which is currently being ignored because it’s pasted over with the 1.2-2.2 million immigrants entering it annually, which is propping up GDP.
This newcomer number is also pasting over a massive exodus of educated Canadians who are leaving for greener pastures, primarily the United States. I guarantee if you cross reference BA holders with those working in government jobs, they’ll have higher salaries, because the federal government is the largest employer in the country. Absolutely none of these indicate Canada has anything to show for it.
I'm making a specific and simple point: education impacts sexual selection. I provided a direct statistic to that point. You seem to be talking about something much broader. I'm talking about how individual women mate with individual men, and how that process is impacted by education. You're talking about some larger issue of how degrees are fake and the economy is imploding. Both of those things can be true at the same time. Degrees can both be diminishing in value to the overall "real" economy, while at the same time playing a role in sexual selection.
The only bug in the thesis is the reliance on, well, an unreliable source called Tinder. I’ve played (with, on,
In) gay versions for several decades. I’ve been the #1 most connected (I don’t like liked) or perhaps notorious, on some. Then I calculated the π r² problem and met Mr. #2 at a nightclub in Barcelona.
#2 was a pimp, knew me at sight, and introduced me to several rent men from ‘the dating app’
Ahh. And the movie producers. Muscular bronzed bearded endowed Poseidon or Zeus figures are quite in demand as prostitutes. I missed my career as a rock hard god.
The chance you talk to ‘a girl’, as you started down the path, is proportional to how far away they are. The candidate pool goes up quite rapidly with the square of the radius irrespective of education.
Sadly the chance you meet someone goes down as the inverse square of the radius. Sadly you’ll meet quite a few people in a pool 1000 miles in radius, but will chance you meet them is zero.
In fact, if you even talk with them you accelerate your isolation because well, there’s only 24 hours in a day, and you are killing time. Using an app isn’t the antitheses of getting laid.
Internet connect people but not sex organs. Quite bad.
I think for a horny gay man, the limit is around a mile, at best. I mean who wants to drive all the way across SF when you can wait for them to come to you… and wait. And wait some more.
In a bar - remember those? Mr. Goodbar? Talking and flirting? Effortlessly easy. Call a Waymo. Bring some friends. Go bar hopping. Good clean fun.
My friends and I who have achieved the near legendary rich muscle daddy nerd visionary hotness tech stratosphere iconic hung HIV-immune homozygous CCR5 delta-32 multilingual multinational status, know that walking to a place where there are people who know who you are is how you get laid all you want. “Cheers”.
Apps are for saps. The house always wins. The more
You play the more you don’t get laid.
Straight and gay, the most popular guys and gals will be hookers, and the fun overeducated are far from
The app having a life, in burning man getting laid, in Mexico on the riviera with friends getting laid, is with friend in Tahiti or have gone en mass to Corsica, or rented a monastery at Ulm, but not wasting quality sex time texting. Naked in the pools of Ventana, 200g of Sass, a nice joint, and more pleasure that people imagine.
Apps are not for the executive women I know. And I know quite a few.
I’m silly and arrogant sexually. But I’m right.
Apps are for saps
The jewish parable of Eve is that once another option is available the female will take it.
At the end you say sexual selectivity is lower, but you said women today are more anxious, neurotic and depressed than before. So what is is then?
Both things can be true at the same time.